|
|
Post by chicago on Jan 14, 2013 12:57:07 GMT -5
Sorry, I forgot to answer your other question you added: "Can you put ball on ball at 80 feet with your marker?... I can?"
Yes, I can. I can double tap two first strike rounds with my T9.1 (a real sniper riffle when it had been suffieciently modifed or purchased in the sniper configuration) and hit my target with those rounds, one hitting on top of the next at 80 yards. That's 80 yards (measured and confirmed multiple times) not 80 feet.
That's probably why we disagree. Many snipers are shooting from over a hundred yards, not hundred feet! It like you have a completely different concept of what we are taking about here on this forum.
A5s are great paintball guns and call it sniping if you want. But, the marker is not a snipers weapon, and a lucky shot at 300 feet using multiple rounds of roundies is not sniping.
|
|
|
|
Post by ruraldawgs on Jan 14, 2013 15:16:11 GMT -5
OK freeenterprise, I watched the video, 80-100 ft was what you said you were shooting.
How big was the square target (as that target saw the most shots) ? Reason I say because we could average it out better than the helmet shot (only 2 shots). If the target was 3 ft square then the grouping on average was 2ft I would say. So my original posting still stands on hard to believe a 300 ft shot in the woods with an A5 (please convince me other wise with another long range vid like the one I just watched, instead of 80 ft).
Even with my T9 and FS kit and FS Lapco non-rifled barrel (with CO2 12 gramers), I get better accuracy than that at 30 yds (90 ft). I shoot FS rounds and use a TruGlow 4x32 scope.
Not going to HS football field, dont worry. Second thoughts are a good thing. Ill measure it off somewhere in the desert this weekend. Test my A5 , T9.0, T9.1. I might be able to make a vid but my vid equipment is not the best.
|
|
|
|
Post by casper on Jan 14, 2013 18:57:26 GMT -5
going out this week to get to shooting again!I will make an attempt at some vid!!
|
|
|
|
Post by freeenterprise on Jan 15, 2013 10:48:12 GMT -5
So my original posting still stands on hard to believe a 300 ft shot in the woods with an A5 (please convince me other wise with another long range vid like the one I just watched, instead of 80 ft). I already did... Watch the videos I posted earlier. This one I hit the target at 350 feet away in TWO shots, the first one flew wonky, and the second was a hit... That is just holding the marker free hand, clearly proving it is possible, and not just "luck". www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CorD-WygPELook, I've been down this road before. I have video proof of what I am saying, but some guys are just close minded. I get it... Believe what you want. But, if you are on the other side of the field from me, and 100-350 feet away, don't be surprised when I shoot you out. With regular paint, and a backspin barrel. I do it all the time, and have tons of video showing it. And I get shot out at long range as well at my field because just about everyone uses Apex barrels as they make that big of a difference with regular paint. At the end of this video you can see TWO long range eliminations at a game at my field. This is from years ago... www.youtube.com/watch?v=LlNdA_xsZyUVideo or it didn't happen... |
|
|
|
Post by ruraldawgs on Jan 15, 2013 11:57:07 GMT -5
1st video is 300 + feet , (1:40 to 1:50) 2 shots and ONLY 1 hit (lucky because I saw the flight path... winger to say the least in my book). Ball didnt break.
So anyways thats a 50% hit ratio. I dont think anyone on this site would call that a sniper shot or a good ratio. NOW if you showed me (us) 10 shots and 7 of them hit the target at that distance I would be impressed with you're A5 shooting that. The rest of that video doesnt even concern me. Im interested in test shots at a distance to prove a point. I dont call that footage evidence of sniper shooting with a modified A5.
Show consistency, back to back at that distance and then were talking apples to apples, because that footage is only 2 shots with 1 hit !
I close with saying that your A5 shoots well with the Apex and current barrel. I might upgrade my A5 to that at some point. But not before sinking more dinero into my T9.1 :-) (or a SR1)
|
|
|
|
Post by trinity on Jan 15, 2013 12:05:15 GMT -5
Enterprise,
In California we have an expression called racing cars for pink slips. You win, you own the other guy's car. You lose, he drives away with yours. I am going to make you a similar offer. I don't know where you are located, but if you are on the West Coast I will meet you at any field that has 75 yards of safe, open space. We shoot ten rounds at a silhouette target on a calm day with a 300 FPS limit from any position the shooter chooses to take. You shoot your A5 with round paint and I will shoot my SR1 with first strikes. Tightest group wins the other's rifle. End of discussion.
For the record, I am shooting a customized SR1 that is worth at least the value of your A5 and probably a whole lot more.
|
|
|
|
Post by freeenterprise on Jan 15, 2013 12:42:39 GMT -5
Seriously... You are challenging me for my paintball gun. hahahhahaha, wow, I've seen it all now.
Why don't you just go out and film yourself hitting a target with 2 shots at 350 feet? Since I've already proved I can do that... Then you will feel better or something? Hey, maybe if you edit it just right, you can do it in ONE shot?... That would show me!
But, seriously, I don't care. Believe what you want, play with what you want. Most of all, have fun. If you think insulting others choices of equipment and elevating yourself to a "higher" level than others because you use "X" brand of whatever makes you better than others then go ahead and believe that. Just don't be shocked when you get tagged by a newbie, as it happens. To everyone who plays a lot...
I've yet to see any good first strike videos that show long range shooting. So maybe one of you could start making some...
As far as the paint not breaking in that video, I was clearly shooting at a piece of paper taped to a garbage can lid... With AIR behind it... I wasn't trying to get a break, I was just proving to Tyger that yes, you can shoot 350 feet with regular paint and an Apex barrel. He didn't believe it. As he thought that max range was 250 feet at safe speeds... Clearly he hasn't used a backspin system before...
But, unlike you guys, he believed what he saw ON VIDEO and hopefully it changed his opinion a little bit.
I wasn't trying to prove "breaks" just that I could do it. And I did... in TWO shots. (50% which is amazing odds at 350 feet with a ROUND paintball).
You guys are funny. First strikes are probably great, (never used one myself) but to act like the only way you can get long range eliminations is with them is silly. Think about how you are all acting... You can clearly see I can shoot 350 feet with regular paint, and that somehow gets you all worked up, as if I am insulting your choice of gear... Or your "sniper" moniker. Or YOUR ability...
I could care less what you use to play paintball. I just want to have fun in the woods with my friends, and capture it on film so I can laugh about it later.
You guys take this "sniper" thing WAAAY to serious, to go so far as to say anyone using regular paint and a stock Tippmann isn't a "paintball sniper" is a very elitist view, and condescending to say the least, especially when I have video that proves my ability. (or "luck" as you have called it)
okey dokey, no wonder this forum has hardly any members. I only found out about this when you started from your thread ON A TIPPMANN forum looking for "paintball snipers".
YOU put a Tippmann subset on here even... Guess you need to figure out how to weed out the "fake" paintball snipers that have clearly infiltrated your camp with their stock Tippmann's shooting regular paint and hitting targets at long range.
lol.
|
|
|
|
Post by chicago on Jan 15, 2013 13:19:45 GMT -5
Really Very Enterprising,
No one is trying to insult you. I think they've just tried to use examples (like my car is faster than yours or I'm shooting 80 yards; not 80 feet) to answer the simple question you asked).
You've switched topics and provided a new cirular argument. After stating normal reaons why there isn't more here on Tippmanns, we've been forced to giving out metaphores in hopes that you'd understand.
"You guys take this "sniper" thing WAAAY to serious..." You've got to be kidding or on something or just looking to be a troll here cause guess what, this is a sniper forum (like a fishman takes his fishing serious). Yes, there is more discussion about Tippmanns on the Tipmann forum. May be that's the final anwer to your quest:
You aren't a paintball sniper; you don't take sniping serious!
Let's end with your other statement:
"If you think insulting others choices of equipment and elevating yourself to a "higher" level than others because you use "X" brand of whatever makes you better than others then go ahead and believe that."
I've used no insult toward you or your choice of weapon. I believe many of your statements have been insulting to the members of this forum. In fact, I've read all the threads in this post and only see you encouraging disparaging words. I suggest we all let him get his last venomness shot out at us and then all other members stop feeding these distortions!
|
|
|
|
Post by Allu on Jan 15, 2013 13:31:57 GMT -5
I don't think trinity is trying to insult you. Let me give you an analogy, when it comes to cross country skiis, you can't just go buy a perfect pair, there are imperfections in them, so the ones that are proven to work are valuable and far between.
The reason for the doubt is that many of us have tried the a-5, c98 apexses and flatlines,
my experience is this; the backspin undoubtedly gives a potential longer range, and iv used the apex to curve obstacles and to some degree even improve accuracy on shorter ranges, but when going further out there just seems to be a potentially much larger spread than with fin stabilized rounds. So generally the apex is a great support barrel when you can shoot volumes but I don't feel it gives me that pinpoint accuracy for precision long range tasks.
Now this only reflects my personal opinion, and by no means do I say that its not possible, I'm just saying that I have never experienced it, hell If I'd had the extra money I'd try to buy your marker from you.
As we have mentioned on this forum before, it doesn't matter what you use, its how you use it, the Tippman markers are like AK-47s their robust reliable, but usually not pinpoint accurate.
Now this is in GENERAL, and there are a lot of them out there and a lot of people has had thus had the same experience.
Now let me tell you a story of AK-47. The Finnish army uses a high quality slightly modified AK-47 copy as their standard assault rifle, in my time I'v had 5 different ones issued to me, all good shooters but one in particular was very accurate. Whit the better one I shot better groupings with open sights, than I can manage with my personal hunting rifles with scopes, (.308 and 8mm Mauser) the other 4, not so much. And for you out there not having any perspective on those rifles that's man size targets at 300m (328.084yards) with the 4 more inaccurate guns.
But ask someone who's been up against untrained personell shooting AK's from the hip if the rifle can be deployed as a precision weapon and they probably say no, I on the other hand know what I can do with one of them... Hand me a Chinese AK copy and I will probably not try that (Yes I'v shot one of those too) do you think that a M-16 made from low grade steel with rougher machining would be as accurate as those you have made in the US?
There I'v rambled on, but i blame that on having a fever, what I'm trying to say is that there's no need to feel excluded or to exclude someone because of their tools, I think we all can agree on that if it works, it's the right tool, be that anything from a dm12 to a paintball bow.
(If i have insulted anyone with my post I do apologize, that is not my intention)
|
|
|
|
Post by trinity on Jan 15, 2013 16:21:15 GMT -5
Enterprise,
No one is trying to insult you. Unlike some of the words in your post, there is no insulting language in mine. It was simply a challenge. Nothing more and nothing less. I made that offer to illustrate a point. That said, the offer still stands. Not that I think you'll accept it because you know very well what the outcome would be. Which was exactly the point I was trying to make.
There are players who play the sniper role using Tippmanns who are very good snipers. The same can be said for some pump players I have played with. Being a sniper is about far more than just long balling at 300 feet. A good sniper is stealthy, has good camouflage, and shoots at ranges that ensure he can consistently hit the targets he engages. Let's for a minute forget the brand names of the rifles and even the respective abilities of the shooters behind them. The undeniable truth is that the ballistics behind the first strike are superior to that of round paint. That's why I can challenge you to a contest on accuracy that you can't win. On this forum we very much believe in one-shot accuracy. That, for example, is why I carry a single-shot, bolt-action rifle. If I needed two shots to hit my target I might often be out of luck.
Players choose to play with Tippmanns for a lot of reasons. Maybe they just like the rifle. Maybe it's a money issue. Maybe they want something that can be used for a bit of sniper work while still maintaining good CQB capabilities. Those are all good reasons to own one. Like Allu said, the A5 is the AK47 of paintball.
On the other hand, if maximum possible single-shot accuracy at long range is what you are striving for, then a rifle that shoots first strikes is what it takes.
By the way, it's rather silly to come to a forum dedicated to snipers and then, when you're challenged to a shooting match, tell them that they take being a sniper way too seriously. Play your game your own way. I very much understand that everyone plays this game just a little differently. Just don't try to tell the players here (many of which are very experienced snipers) that round paintballs are the equal ballistically of first strikes. That won't fly here (no pun intended).
Unlike Tyger (who isn't a sniper and doesn't pretend to be), I am not persuaded by your video, nor do I intend to go shoot one myself. Why would I do that? I know what my rifle is capable of and I would rather just settle any disagreements over its accuracy with an old-fashioned shooting match. After ten rounds my target will speak for itself.
|
|
|
|
Post by freeenterprise on Jan 28, 2013 19:55:37 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by chicago on Jan 28, 2013 20:25:19 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by ruraldawgs on Jan 29, 2013 18:07:06 GMT -5
Enterprise: no one is saying you cant hit what your aiming at, AND that you dont have a good marker setup to accomplish that with.
I think the consensus is that your marker isnt considered a sniper marker... that is can you hit the target consistently without misses in between at a distance. I have seen all the videos you have posted and they dont convince me. None of the long shots show 5 hits in a row with a 12 inch or less grouping at distance. All of them show (what I would call) lucky hits. Albeit, you know how to aim your marker well.
|
|
|
|
Post by freeenterprise on Mar 9, 2013 21:23:49 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by chicago on Mar 16, 2013 12:06:39 GMT -5
Don't worry Free, we understand:  it ok to be different. Most of us are on your side. Why would we want a piece of crap like this:  when we could own somethin' cool like an A5 Tippman. Just kidding you man. To each his own, and from your vids, you are an excellent shot. You can play on my team any time! |
|
|
|
Post by chicago on Mar 21, 2013 16:02:55 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by p on Jul 21, 2013 17:03:35 GMT -5
I have answer. Cause Tippman's aren't as cool as TiBerius or Chicago's and Trinity's SR1s. Sorry, someone just had to tell him! Lol that's just your opinion. I have a tippmann 98 custom that shoots better and more accurate then the t9.1 with first strikes. I just breach feed them with the tippmann |
|
|
|
Post by ruraldawgs on Jul 22, 2013 15:52:20 GMT -5
I have been playing in a league since this spring (tactical paintball league). Every game we play my cohorts on the 5 man team tell me I get more and more deadly. I have yet to see anyone (including very experienced speedball players) come close to my accuracy per shot. This weekend I had a 60 yd head shot. The look on everyone's face was priceless. AND there were a bunch of Tippmans out there, all mod-ed up with APEX etc... We have a "Sniper" role on the team and I consistently get the 5 pts (for a sniper shot/kill) every game we play. Its not just OPINION from those of us running true sniper platforms (scopes, rifled barrels, FSR), its fact ;-)
|
|
|
|
Post by lordkyleofearth on Sept 19, 2013 17:10:27 GMT -5
After reading through this thread for a second time I find myself unsure of a couple things. It would appear that, as a group, 'sniper' is being defined as a person who makes accurate shots at extreme ranges, and little else.
At 70-100 yards, a BDU jacket and some grass is sufficient to avoid being seen by most players. So, really, all that is left is sharp shooting at ranges where standard balls fall short (pardon the pun). That then discounts anyone who does not choose to use the FSR platform, which thereby eliminates all 'snipers' at fields that disallow FSRs.
Free seems to be able to regularly make those long shots that he claims. It might take a couple of shots, but he makes them all day long. At 100 yards, most players will not be able to identify where the shots are coming from. That fits my definition pretty well.
Most, if not all, of my local fields do not allow the use of FSRs. But I am deadly with my ghillie and a CCI Phantom shooting regular paint. As was previously mentioned, some times it's about how close you can get, not how far youcan shoot.
It just seems like a slippery slope to so narrowly define the role of sniper. Yes, FSRs have revolutionized the game. Yes, a marker that fires them will always be more accurate than a Tippmann. But before Tiberius, the game still had 'Snipers' and they shot everything under the sun.
Just my 2ยข, carry on.
|
|
|
|
Post by White Feather on Sept 19, 2013 21:22:20 GMT -5
I can feel where you are coming from as I myself used tactics and stealth to close distance and make shots from a concealed location. One ball one break was always the motto. However, since the inception of the FSR, the game has changed and so have the platform whIch we choose to shoot them from. I feel sorry for you in the fact that the fields you play on don't allow FSRs. And even though there are a few around me that are still that way, I travel to games all up and down the east coast of the U.S. that do. I would be willing to wager that a majority of the folks on this forum do just the same and not stick exclusively to local fields for their play. All I can recommend is for you to get out more and see what else is around you in other counties or even other states/regions. I have traveled from VA to MD and down to FL to play paintball. I'm trying to get to CPX next year for LL7 and maybe even to Canada and pay a visit to PRZ Paintball, a field that looks absolutely amazing!
If you want to call yourself a sniper based on your argument and my support of it in my opening statement, go on ahead. But, just know that there are those amongst us that have greater capability and equipment that will be argued to be superior. Based on that, you will likely not win the argument with many others. Simply put, damn the haters and just play your game the way you want however you can. That IS the point of paintball in the first place is it not?
|
|
